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WHERE BRANDING GOES WRONG
In today’s episode of the podcast, I’m joined by the talented creatives behind Rendezvous Creative to chat about where branding goes wrong and what you can do to avoid these all-too-common missteps. During this fun and no-holds-barred conversation, we explore common branding mistakes we see in the creative, online business owner space, and what steps new and established entrepreneurs alike can take instead.
If you’ve been wondering how to brand your service-based business in a way that aligns with your values and sets you up for long-term success, then today’s episode may be just what you’re looking for.
Tune in for the full episode above!
MEET RENDEZVOUS CREATIVE
Rendezvous Creative is a full-service brand development, coaching + execution agency. We work with ambitious business owners and entrepreneurs who are building bigger, better brands, sister brands, and sub-brands — and who want their brand to feel like dipping their toes into a mountain of bubbles, full of possibility. Rather than working with just visuals in mind, we dig into our clients’ brand mission, vision, and values. From there, we offer full-service brand design, copy and content, marketing strategy, and more.
CONNECT WITH RENDEZVOUS CREATIVE
Visit their website – rendezvouscreative.com
Connect on Instagram – instagram.com/rendezvous.creative
Grab their amazing freebie! https://rendezvouscreative.com/brand-mix-quiz
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Please note this transcript has been auto generated and may contain typos.
Bonnie (00:07):
Hi, friend, and welcome to the Brand Strategy Podcast, a show created to equip you with the inspiration, encouragement, and clarity you need to build a brand Of your dreams. I’m your host, Bonnie Bakhtiari, brand designer, strategist, and founder of the Illume Retreat. From Sustainable Strategy to Heartfelt Encouragement. Each episode is designed to equip you with the tools you need to chase after your dreams because you deserve a brand that empowers you to do what you love, connects with your dream clients, and offers a deep sense of fulfillment along the way. So grab a cup of coffee and join me on this journey, won’t you
Bonnie (00:44):
Friends,
Bonnie (00:45):
Welcome back to the Brand Strategy Podcast, where today we’re talking about where branding goes wrong with the incredible folks at Rendezvous Creative. I’m personally really excited to have this conversation about where branding goes wrong because, well, you know, here on the podcast we talk a lot about like how it goes right and you know, what, what it, and its best iterations for your business can look like. But today we’re gonna be talking a little bit more about, um, where we might be missing the mark with our branding and some thoughtful shifts we can make in order to, uh, really correct that over time so that your business can thrive and see, uh, more sustainable growth towards how you personally define success. So as we get into this, let me share a little bit about who Rendezvous Creative is and the incredible people behind this business.
Bonnie (01:31):
Um, Rendezvous Creative is a full service brand development, coaching and execution agency, and they work with ambitious business owners and entrepreneurs to build bigger, better brands that are packed with possibility. Um, the powerhouse women behind this business are Nicole, Latasha and Megan and I am personally very excited to have all three of them chatting with me today, uh, because not only are they so incredibly talented in their respective industries, but the way that they’ve chosen to team up in order to better serve their ideal clients through this combination of their skills and their talents. Uh, well, I’m a big fan, so ladies, welcome back to the podcast. I’m so excited to get to chat with you. And if you’re up for it, I’d love to hear a little bit more about, you know, rendezvous and how, how this all came to be. So Nicole, do you wanna kind of kick it off for us?
Nicole (02:28):
Yes. Hi, and thank you so much for having us Bonnie. Everyone. Hello, I’m Nicole. I’m the brand designer behind Rendezvous and I’d love for the other two women to introduce themselves to before we answer this question. Yeah.
Latasha (02:41):
I’m Latasha. I am the copywriter and marketing strategist for Rendezvous.
Megan (02:46):
I’m Megan. I am the equity centered coach for Rendezvous and kind of act as your client concierge through the entire process.
Nicole (02:54):
I love client concierge.
Megan (02:57):
That makes me, I mean, it’s, it is such a luxury thing. Like you go to a fancy hotel and the concierge is there to help you with your decisions because they’re so experienced.
Nicole (03:06):
Exactly. That’s actually what I love the most about our team now is Latasha says this in a great way. We’re like the back office team that is now suddenly coming to the forefront. And we’ve, we’ve been a part of lots of teams in the past and we’ve, we’ve seen some ish, you know what I mean? ,
Megan (03:27):
That’s a kind way of putting it. Now we have to
Nicole (03:29):
Compile all of that and bring it to new people. ,
Latasha (03:32):
I don’t remember who proposed Rendezvous first, but it was sort of, we were having happy hours, um, I think it was 2021 maybe late 2021. And we were all talking about clients and we were all kind of talking about how all these pieces that we do individually all go together. And at one point, I don’t know who suggested this, but this whole idea that, you know, we create a system that is cohesive so that all of these pieces can flow together so that it’s not just, you know, the visual brand and then copy and then offers and like, you know, your outward, um, marketing and presence. All those pieces go together to really elevate the brand and showcase like how your brand is different. And that’s sort of how Rendezvous was born. I wish I could credit one person with it though.
Megan (04:19):
. Well, and we each, like in our respective businesses saw all of this being piecemealed and one that’s like on a very basic level that’s just not cost effective. It’s not two, it’s not time effective. And three, we were seeing clients who were getting so frustrated, which is really like not, not disheartening in a way where it’s like, oh, I don’t wanna do my business anymore. But disheartening in like, oh, but this could be so much easier like this. It’s, I’m really sorry that you have to carry all of the administrative weight, the emotional weight, the intellectual weight of trying to make all of this fit together. And then Exactly. There’s, you know, insert the infomercial, there’s gotta be a better way , and there is, it’s us .
Nicole (05:07):
It’s also
Nicole (05:08):
Hard too, like Bonnie, I don’t know if you’ve ever seen this with your clients, but like, when you work with someone for a really long time and the process is taking a while and you see that they’re working with other contractors and it’s taking so long for people to like talk and collaborate, that you see the spark just drain out of them and you’re just like, man, you have this beautiful idea to start with and everyone was so excited and you were loving your business and now all of it is dead. Yeah. That’s really heartbreaking when you just don’t get your team to really collaborate and like make it happen when you want and how you want.
Bonnie (05:43):
Yeah. So instead of having to like piecemeal all of these different aspects of, of either rebranding or branding from scratch, you’re able to, um, you know, partner with y’all and go through the entire process from start to finish without compromising on not only the, um, effectiveness of that brand and that strategy, but also then having the support of being able to really, uh, I guess implement everything throughout like key messaging and offer details and everything that goes into that, right?
Megan (06:18):
Mm-hmm. . Exactly. Our, our big thing is like, it all comes back to your values, it comes back to your mission, your vision. Like, and this is going to inform all of the things. ’cause it’s not Latasha’s job as the copywriter to be like, let me clarify your values for you.
Latasha (06:35):
That’s, well, I think that’s one of the most frustrating parts as individual service providers is seeing how something could be improved upon and not being able to do it in your own particular scope or niche. Like I’m a copywriter, I can definitely help you solidify your messaging, but if you don’t know what your offers and your values are at the end of the day, like I can’t help you with that. Not because they don’t want to, but because it’s not where my skillset lies. And that was probably the, the most impactful part of like the roadmap that we’ve created is starting with values and then letting that influence everything else. And I think that that’s something that everybody can take away from like a branding process in general is if you’re feeling really discouraged by how your brand is turning out, going back to like the root of it and what really matters,
Bonnie (07:20):
Having that experience over the years of seeing how, you know, things kind of, uh, can feel a little bit, um, what’s the word I’m looking for? Uh, you know, not as cohesive as they could be. We’ll just, we’ll just put it that way. But disjointed seeing, yes, seeing how, uh, when you’re working with clients and they’re having to find the support from all these different places or they’re not necessarily able to figure out on their own how all this can come together. I’m curious, um, over the years as you see business owners who aren’t quite nailing down their branding, is it ultimately because of they, the need for them to like, seek out support from all these different service providers and so working with different people is resulting in this very like, kind of disconnected process? Or do you think that it’s, it’s something different altogether where, you know, if, if we’re talking about where branding goes wrong, is it that as an industry we’re not necessarily offering these cohesive experiences that are delivering everything that the clients need? Or is it, uh, is it something different entirely?
Nicole (08:31):
I think it’s so many things It is definitely partly that you are working with so many different people that you’ve, you’re working on so many different processes that aren’t kind of aligning. But a lot of it too is that you often, when you rebrand, you’re only thinking about the visual portion of your brand. But a brand is so much more than that. It’s so holistic. And the way we see it, it at Rendezvous is we break branding down into four pillars. So there is a branding and a visual side to your brand, then there’s the tone of your brand, there’s the interpersonal side, which is the customer service and how you’re actually interacting with your audience. And then there’s the intellectual side, which is how you’re designing your offers and how you’re talking about them marketing them. And it’s really interesting because business owners know about all four of these things.
Nicole (09:21):
Whenever, you know, they create content or whenever they’re in their business every day they are thinking about all these four aspects of, okay, how do we get this new offer out to people, which Instagram posts put up which TikTok videos, and then what happens when they go through the pipeline, but they’re not thinking about it as functions of one brand that is based on a specific set of values. And I think that’s really hard because if you’re leading a project with three different contractors for a rebrand, not only are you going down three different contractors processes, but you are not able to say, this is what I need from you. I need you to help me fulfill these four different things.
Latasha (10:03):
Yeah, I see it like a game of telephone, right? Where you say something to somebody else and then it gets passed on and as it gets passed on and gets diluted. So then by the end of that process, when you’re working with multiple contractors, you’re seeing these things that are close but not quite what you intended. And it’s through no fault of the contractors, it’s more that like it’s passed through their process, like Nicole was saying, or you know, you worked with a web designer who then referred you to a copywriter who didn’t necessarily know the intention behind the strategy. Like there’s so many things that could happen and um, like with the game of telephone, things get misconstrued
Megan (10:39):
And if I may nerd moment with the game of telephone, the, it’s the language that becomes so distorted because we interpret things emotionally. And so when we’re like, as that one phrase is being interpreted through the telephone with each iteration, it’s being emotionally twisted in a way because somebody’s interpreting it through how they receive those emotions and what they got from it. And then applying it to language, which again, bring it back full circle where we come back to with the values. Like, if you don’t have those strong values, no matter how, like how many iterations it goes through, if you can come back to those values, it’s like, okay, well that’s where we’re headed. That’s what this is rooted in. That’s a foundation, but without it, we just get this emotional language that’s just been distorted and distorted and distorted and what you may have originally, like these are my values when you started, but you never stated it, you’ve got a completely different set, five iterations down the telephone later
Nicole (11:40):
Mm-hmm. mm-hmm. . And it might be a good set of values, five different versions of the telephone leader. Oh yeah. But then no one else knows about it. , none of your other contractors have heard that conversation.
Megan (11:52):
Yeah. And they might not be, they could be great values, but they might not be your values.
Nicole (11:57):
Hmm. So true. I, this is a really ridiculous example to bring up, but I’ve been thinking about it so much lately. We had a cookout a couple weeks ago and we had like 10 people over. And normally we’ll do this thing where we kind of say, okay, we’ll we need a salad or we need some fruit, or we need, you know, potato salad or whatever. And we didn’t do that this time. And literally everyone showed up with pasta salad . So we had first and like an entire table full of different iterations of pasta salad. And that is how I feel the branding process is is if no one talks to each other, everyone has a different idea of like what their one little thing is, but their one little piece of the pie is, but no one is communicating to either put together a great, like idyllic cookout spread. Everyone just takes this one piece of the pie, which they usually think is the visual side. And so you’ve got five different interpretations of pasta salad instead of an entire meal.
Bonnie (13:00):
Yeah, absolutely. I think, um, and, and , I love that because first of all, like I love pasta salad and I like carbs are my love language. Absolutely. Um, but even I, an absolute carb aficionado would be like overwhelmed by, you know, like 10 different types of pasta salad at the cookout. But anyway, um, I digress. I, I personally like look back over the years that I’ve been in this industry and I have seen, uh, you know, I’ve had, you know, inquires, uh, inquiring, you know, clients asking about, you know, like, oh, just logo design. I’ve had conversations with, um, you know, even like newly booked clients where we’re, we’re kind of like setting that expectation of, you know, we’re gonna be diving into the brand strategy and the brand strategy will then influence the design decisions we make. Because yes, the visuals are important, but they are nothing without the, the nuance and the context of the brand strategy, um, from my perspective.
Bonnie (14:04):
Uh, but when we get that kind of visual-based tunnel vision in the online space, which it, it, it makes sense, right? Like it, it completely makes sense to me because we are, you know, showing up on these, these social platforms we’re showing up and we’re connecting with people on Pinterest or through their YouTube channel or through their, their blog. And, and we’re seeing a lot of this visual content because we’re engaging with a lot of these visual heavy, uh, you know, spaces. So that being said, when we get that, that vision-based tunnel vision and we overlook the values side of things, and we overlook that starting with those foundational components actually gives like all, all the flavor and all of the like secret sauce to what your visual branding can actually be. Um, you know, I kind of like nerd out about this, but like, as, as a strategist and designer, that’s, that’s where I think that branding goes wrong is when we focus so heavily on the visuals that we unintentionally rob ourselves of the richness and the full amount of flavor that we could be experiencing if we instead focused on those more foundational components like brand strategy, like values, like, uh, you know, understanding your key messaging themes and then understanding how to weave that throughout your visuals.
Bonnie (15:25):
And that’s where working with pros who know how to take all of these like, seemingly unrelated concepts and then weaving them together and, and bringing it to life. That’s why I think it’s like just so smart that y’all have teamed up to, to run Rendezvous and the way that you’re running it.
Megan (15:43):
Oh, thank you. We are very smart , but I, I kind of like to refer to it as the the boss Babe black Hole because everyone’s doing it. It just pulls you in and it’s already this kind of semi defined brand that is really kind of amorphous and it kind of shifts and it’s so hard not to get pulled into that gravitational field. And oh my gosh, now everything looks the same. And I know that my process is different. I know that my values are different. I know that what I do is wildly different and folks need it, but I have absolutely no language. I have no copy, I have no voice, and every, it looks the same as everything else. Mm-hmm.
Nicole (16:23):
. Yeah. Megan, you talk about brand fatigue a lot and Latasha too. Like if, if you’re just constantly looking at what you’re supposed to look like and what the black hole is sucking you into, and you’re never coming back to the things that actually matter to you, it just feels like you’re just putting on a mask and performing every single day instead of doing the business that you thought was gonna fire you up every single day.
Latasha (16:46):
I think that’s so easy to do. Like, I mean, all of us know what it’s like to just be so swamped in your day to day that you’re just like, you know what? I don’t have time to think about like my higher values. I need to just get this Canva graphic up. Like I just need to do
Megan (16:59):
It.
Latasha (17:01):
And I think that we’ve all been there, right? Like we understand that fully. But the truth is that the businesses that have the most fulfilled owners and the businesses that have the most dedicated audience are the ones that are able to take that step back, do the deeper work, and use that on a daily basis. Because we all want that, right? We all want more breathing room in our days to be able to like, think critically about where the business is going. And I think that treating your business as that, like your brand as your step back, I think is really valuable.
Nicole (17:30):
Mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. . I think we also get into this conversation a lot about authenticity and like, I know that that sometimes feels like a conversation that was five years ago, and it also feels like it’s super important now, but I think that I’ve been a part of so many teams where my clients are like, I want to actually be authentic. I don’t wanna be the version of authentic that is like Instagram happy, but I don’t know how to do that. And I think that’s when you come into like, are you taking the visuals and actually applying it to every part of your brand? Are you applying it to the offers and to the tone and to the relationships that you have? Or are you just rebranding and then saying that it feels more like you,
Megan (18:15):
Once again, we return to emotional language. The word authentic is an emotionally charged word for all of us. And in my opinion, the reason it feels like a five years ago conversation and still a today conversation is that nobody is defining it for themselves. We all have different definitions of what it means to be authentic, and we’re never one taking the time to define it for ourselves because it’s an emotion. Like it’s this emotional thing. So like, I just know it when I like, it’s like porn. I know it when I see it . Well, yes. Also, there are definable characteristics that everyone is a little bit different on. So what are those definable characteristics for you? Can you standardize those to a certain extent for your brand so that you know, this is what it means for me to be authentic so that even like when you’re get, again, the boss bay black hole is pulling you in, you can go hold up.
Megan (19:07):
This is how I define authenticity. So like what I’m seeing, I’m feeling the compulsion to do, I can, I can recognize it, I can see it, I can maybe acknowledge that there’s some therapy stuff coming in that I do not need to bring to my brand. And then like, oh, this, I’ve already defined authenticity for me. This is clearly not right. I can address my therapy problems that are coming into my business and step back, step away, do my own thing. Which side note, therapy problems always, if you run your own business, therapy problems are going to come into your business. If you try to, if you try to say that like, no, I never have a therapy problem come into my business, you’re lying. You’re not self-aware. You have other things to work on. ,
Latasha (19:49):
I do think that that comes up a lot when people want to just rebrand. Yeah. You know, like they bring up this like, oh, I just need a rebrand. I just need a fresh start. And it’s usually because they’re feeling that crunch, whether it’s like you’re feeling the financial crunch or you’re realizing that your ideal audience is changing, your business is going to shift. It just is. But the second you have that instinct to like, I need to just redo my website and my Instagram graphics, that’s usually a sign that you need to dive deeper because those are not necessarily the things that are going to fix what you want to fix. They’re just going to like, it’s like the, you know, tape over the windows kind of thing. Paper over the windows.
Bonnie (20:28):
Latasha, that was such a great point. I’m curious as we’re having this conversation, and you know, we’re, we’re starting to dive a little bit deeper into like what it looks like when we’re defining these concepts like authenticity and when we are defining what our values look like, and we’re really taking ownership of that, and we are being clear about what that looks like and what that feels like for us as individual business owners. Um, I’d love to hear y’all’s thoughts on, for, for those who already have a very established brand, for people who’ve been in business for a couple of years who maybe have gone through a professional branding process and maybe have worked with a professional copywriter before, but perhaps they’re, they’re feeling kind of that disconnect and perhaps they’re wondering where things could be refined or elevated. Uh, where, what kind of advice do you have?
Bonnie (21:17):
What kind of thoughts do you have on that sort of situation? Because it’s, it’s, it’s all well and good for us to be talking about this and kind of, you know, uh, dreaming about like if we were, you know, going through this process in like, kind of a perfect world and this is how it looks and this is how it goes for each business owner, that’s great . But for those who already have invested their time and their energy and their resources into building a brand, what are some steps they can take in order to, you know, kind of get things on track with their individual values?
Nicole (21:51):
I think when I approach a brand, it’s always two things. It’s the marriage of like what you bring to the table and what your audience is expecting from a service provider like you. And I feel like established entrepreneurs when they’re going through a rebrand, often what they’re doing is saying, okay, I grew out of this part of my brand and now I need to become more professional and more legit. And in my mind that means serif fonts and editorial like photos and beige and strong blacks. And so they assign all these things that they think are supposed to help them feel more legitimate in that kind of space. And then they forget about the magic sauce that they bring to the table. And I think that what I would love for entrepreneurs to know is that you can have both of those things. You can level up and deliver something that looks legitimate and professional and whatever that means to you. And you can still bring in your values and that thing that makes you you, the thing that makes it special to work with you and only you. Um, so that would be my first thing is don’t forget about the special sauce
Megan (23:04):
Root of Nicole to take a very real life example of the crisis of conscience I had late last year, but fine, whatever, , which act like, again, side note, like we, we teach these things, we preach these things, we do this as our business. We’ve started this agency, the three of us. That doesn’t mean we’re immune from everything that we’re talking about. Well
Nicole (23:25):
Gracious now, ,
Megan (23:26):
Oh no, we may be able to recognize it, but honest to God, last, like right at the new year, Nicole and Natasha talked me off my own little cliff of like, but I’m going on maternity leave and everything’s changing and so I should probably just redo everything. No,
Latasha (23:46):
No. I, I think too that usually when we’re talking to more established business owners and they want to evaluate their brand, it also comes down to their offers. So like Nicole’s talking about what you offer, like what your audience expects, but when they’re more established, usually what’s happened is they’ve collected offers like Pokemon and they’re sitting on a, like a literal, not goldmine, but like a pile of offer ideas or offers that they’ve built that they have grown out of that they don’t feel reflects ’em that much, that haven’t gotten that much traction. And it’s doing that work to go back to the values, go back to like, you know, what you, what you want to do at your core and looking at those offers and saying, does this actually serve me and my audience? And going from there, I think that, you know, instead of looking at just the, like the brand visuals, when you, when you’re feeling that like, this business no longer feels like me or what I wanna do, it’s not necessarily looking at the visuals, it’s looking at what you offer first. Um, I think that’s where most established business owners get stuck.
Nicole (24:52):
Can we have a quick conversation about how when we’re working with established business owners, a lot of the stuff we have to overcome is stuff that they’ve just learned from like the business world that’s actually not serving them. Like the fact that they have 5 million offers and they have all these different funnels and the fact that they have stopped having meetings in their business because they read in a book somewhere that meetings are not productive and they started siloing their entire team because they feel like that’s the best way to save a buck or two. Like, I think that we start picking up all these habits as business owners ’cause we’re trying to grow so much and so fast and they’re not healthy habits, and we don’t have the ability right now to discern how do I use this habit in a way that’s actually productive for me? And when do I need to let go of this habit in order to make some progress?
Latasha (25:47):
And y’all are pulling frameworks from coaches that have no business being in your business. That is a really big problem in our industry. Mm. Um, you know, we learn a lot about like how to run our business better and, you know, frameworks for operating better and some of them work, some of them don’t. The same goes for like, offer frameworks. You know, like a few years ago everybody had to have a course, and I know so many clients who are like, that did not work out for me at all. And then, you know, now it’s funnels or you need to have this one micro offer, or you need to have these like self-liquidating offers on Facebook. And it’s like all these coaches or programs are selling you into things you have to do for your business and you’re not getting the results. And then you fall out of love with your business and then you’re thinking, oh, I just need to rebrand. And that’s not true. ,
Megan (26:32):
This is what I like to term the online business industrial complex, excuse me, quick history lesson. The like noun industrial complex was first coined by Eisenhower immediately after World War ii. And he was like, Hey, we did Great America, but also we should probably keep an eye on the military industrial complex because a lot of our economic growth came outta the military and we shouldn’t keep doing that. Side note we did. It’s really not great, uh, . And along that line of like the self-sustaining economy, snake eating its tail cyclical situation, we have an equivalent in the online business industry. It is the online business industrial complex where it is built to make money for a few people at the top who have ha who are the big celeb entrepreneurs, who are the names that we know all across the board who have the answer for how you start a business, how you write your copy, how you design your graphics, how you show up on social media.
Megan (27:34):
They have a very specific definition of what it means to be authentic, to type back into what we were talking about earlier. And, and this is exactly what Latasha is speaking to of these, this is the framework, this is the answer. And it’s wildly unhelpful and possible to do business outside of the online business industrial complex. It feels so hard to try to shoot out of that gravitational pull because it is around us. It pulls us in and we are always fighting against our sunk cost fallacy of like, but I’ve spent so much time doing this, but I spent, but I spent $5,000 on the designer with some, like, it’s gorgeous, but it’s a terrible, it’s terrible visuals for me. , I spent $7,500 having this copywriter write me my sales page. One, I think Latasha, and I would agree with me on this, you sh like a, a singular sales page should not cost $7,500, but that’s a different spicy soapbox for a different day. . Now I just lost my train of thought. , I just got, so I got so worked up about these, about overcharging another part of the industrial business complex charging what you’re worth. Yes. Mm,
Bonnie (28:53):
Mm-hmm. . I think that it’s impossible really, if, if we wanna be like completely honest about all the different systems that are at play here. When you’re looking at branding your online service-based business, when you’re looking at branding your creative business, um, it is, it’s impossible to divorce your business and the ideas that are surrounding you and the information that you have access to. It’s, it’s impossible from my perspective to divorce that from the online business industrial complex. And I think that it’s also important to acknowledge that when we are taking all of this very, in some cases, I, I don’t wanna make a blanket statement, but in some cases well-intentioned advice from some of these, you know, quote unquote online experts, uh, the harm that we can experience not just in our businesses, but also personally because the advice that you’re receiving, and I’m speaking from personal experience here, I have absolutely taken and implemented so much, so much advice from, you know, the, the experts of, of the Minute and bought into, in some cases very heavily invested my own money into some of these systems and tools and, and, you know, courses and programs that promised me a play by play system of how to do X, Y, and Z.
Bonnie (30:18):
And, and knowing that a lot of us we’re gonna spend time and energy and money trying to implement all of these things that we’ve been told are the right thing to do, or the best way to do business or the most successful way to do it. And what we lose aside from our time and our energy and our resources, we also then lose the, uh, the uniqueness and the possibility that we could experience if we figured out how to do it ourselves and how to do it in a way that aligns with our values and how to do it in a way that feels like you and it feels like the brand that you wanna be building and that aligns with the impact that you wanna be having for yourself, for your family, for your clients, your customers, and in some cases maybe the industry as a whole. Um, so I, I kind of love that we like went in this direction because when we are thinking about where branding goes wrong, one way, at least from my perspective, that branding goes wrong, is that we are all trying to live up to these unrealistic standards of authentic, you know, girl boss or girl boy perfection. That we’re never really real in the first place and were never really designed for, for people like you or me to ever be successful with.
Nicole (31:41):
Mm-hmm. . Yes. And I know that feels so scary to let go of, even when you feel like it’s not the right fit for you, it feels like, oh, my business is going to completely sink if I stopped doing these things that people are telling me to do. But I would also, I just wanna encourage everyone, like think about those brands that you see that are doing things completely different, that are total renegades and how compelling and amazing that is. Like your business can be that too. Like, we can all do the things that we feel were our superpowers when we first started and then got diluted by just like the machine of the online mess and noise out there. Like it can be really beautiful and really fruitful to let go of it. Mm-hmm. ,
Latasha (32:30):
I think too that so many people are worried that like they have to have this big, loud, boisterous personality to really stand out with a brand that’s like eye catching and all these things, right? But the truth is that there are ways to pull out the pieces of your brand that are the most impactful, that are like quiet, right? That mm-hmm. , you know, maybe you wouldn’t think like, oh, this is gonna speak to somebody, but it does. Some of my favorite brands are the most, um, calm, serene brands and they do it so well because they’re not playing into this like, oh, we have to be loud and noisy and all these things. Um, but I also think that there’s this, you know, in our, in our website, in our copy, we talk about where your brand finally meets your vision because the thing that got you started with this business is not gonna be the thing that it, it ends up as, right?
Latasha (33:20):
Like, it’s like Frankenstein’s monster after a while you’re just like piling on new pieces and you’re like, this was never my intention . Like, I wanted it to look something like this and I wanted this out of my business. You know, for me, when I started my business, it was, it was literally a place for me to come build a, a place where I could work that matched my disability. So now my entire brand is built around that. And at Rendezvous, our entire brand is built around helping people see the whole picture, right? So a lot of our brand is gonna be reflective of all these little pieces that are like, we bring ourselves to it, but we also have to, um, continually remind ourselves of what the actual intention is because it’s so easy. Like, like you said, to get drowned out. You know, after a while of having all this input and thinking I have to do it a certain way to succeed, that that’s just not true. And people are looking for different, different brands now.
Megan (34:15):
And especially working, working as a team, working as an agency, we put ourselves through our own rendezvous roadmap. We put ourselves through our own process, one to test it out, uh, because that’s just good business, uh, , but perhaps more importantly to, to give each of our individual personalities the flavors that we each bring to our individual businesses and help us consolidate. Okay? This is where Megan is allowed quote unquote, to get super spicy because it is a part of our brand. This is where Latasha is gonna go on her cussing streak. This is where Nicole is gonna step onto this, her spicy soapbox about color and about fonts and about the, now you don’t need 45 different colors in your color palette, but it, it’s, it’s both consolidating and standardizing so that you have this place to come back to. We don’t have any question about like, Ooh, can I talk about that on Instagram? Ooh, does this copy work on my website? No, we already laid that foundation. No, we already see that big picture. No, we’ve already not just like, had the emotional feel of where we want this to go. We’ve put it into language, we’ve put it into visuals. We’ve stand, take it full circle to the four brand pillars. We have the visuals, we have the tone, we have a very clearly stated client experience, the interpersonal, we have a clear marketing strategy, the intellectual, and we can see where all of this intersects to create rendezvous, creative.
Latasha (35:46):
And you have a framework, you know? Mm-hmm. , when you really think about those four elements of your brand, you have a framework to, to grade yourself on, right? Like, as you’re creating content, as you’re discovering like what you wanna do in your business next, it gives you a framework to really say this fits or this doesn’t. Decision fatigue is so real
Megan (36:05):
And you could have a really great idea that isn’t right for your brand. And this is where I personally, like in coaching and language and messaging strategy, this is where I see so many folks go a little bit off the rails ’cause it’s a really great idea and it’s just not right for you. And I don’t know about y’all, but like, as a creative, that is so frustrating for me. ’cause I’m like, ah, who do I, I need to give this idea to someone who it’s right for because it’s so good and I wanna see it in the world. That might also be my Enneagram nine .
Bonnie (36:40):
Well, I feel like when you are, you know, kind of, you have those foundational pieces in place and you have that framework in place, right? That then makes it so clear when the opportunity arises. Like let’s say like Megan, you were just talking about like, you know, oh, I, I have all these great ideas and I, you know, I’ll be having this conversation or I’ll be, you know, diving into this thing and I, I have this great idea, but it’s not the best fit for this business or for this brand. Well then would it maybe be, be a good fit for a sister brand, for a sub-brand for something different? Is it maybe just a great idea that like should be shared with a, you know, one of your biz besties and like they can run with it and see what comes of it, you know? But like how do, because I know this is something that y’all also do at Rendezvous. Like it’s not just, you know, creating like one-off brands, it’s also looking at your client’s businesses holistically and helping them figure out, okay, how can we integrate, uh, in a very strategic and thoughtful way, a sister brand perhaps. So what, where does, how do you see that coming to life for people and how does that kind of tie into what we’re talking about?
Latasha (37:55):
Nicole has a very good framework for this, but I also just wanna start out by saying that like the sub-brand versus Sister Brandand discussion is usually something that like, you don’t want to think about pulling something out and like starting a sub-brand or sister brand until you have a very clear idea of the offer and what it’s going to actually provide people. Because that will decide like anything that what, what, whether or not it becomes a sub-brand, a sister brand, or it needs to like just be shared with your collective mm-hmm.
Nicole (38:23):
. And it’s surprising too, like you’ll often think of something that could be a sub-brand or a sister brand and you’re like, oh yeah, I’ll just make it and then let it happen. But I’ve seen so many of my clients spend literal years in their brain saying, I, for some reason, this doesn’t feel right. Like it needs to happen, but I can’t figure out where it fits. And it prevents them from just doing the thing that they’re excited about. So the framework that we give them is like, it’s almost like a flow chart. Like, remember when should I wash my hair? Today was a big thing. amazing. They
Bonnie (38:55):
Literally have that print hanging in my bathroom
Nicole (38:58):
. I need that for every part of my life. And so that’s what this is. It’s like, okay, do you have an idea that still applies to the same audience that you’re talking to, but it just fulfills a different need? Is it fulfilling a similar need, but it’s a totally different audience. Like these things are gonna help you determine where and it fit, where it fits as a sub-brand or a sister brand, or if you need to just totally create something completely new and evolve into a totally different era of your life, that’s really exciting too. But that’s what we mean by having so many frameworks for these things. It’s like we’re not just gonna tell you to figure it out. Like let’s go through the flow chart together and eliminate the decision fatigue. And like Latasha keeps saying like, maintain the excitement that you have about your business.
Bonnie (39:51):
I love that. And having these frameworks in place, having, having those systems, you know, not only does that start to eliminate that decision fatigue, but also it, it makes it easy to have a process that you can come back to. The process doesn’t change what you bring to the process might, but the process itself of how you figure out those next steps will remain consistent. Um, wow. I honestly think that we probably could like take this topic and like spin it off into its own separate podcast of like spicy branding thoughts with the four of us. Um, but being mindful of, you know, y’all’s time being mindful of what are some next steps, those who are tuning in today can take, um, I love it. If each of you could share kind of a final closing piece of advice or encouragement around this idea of pursuing branding from a values-based space, pursuing branding, uh, with the support of experts who will guide you through this process versus feeling the pressure to, um, you know, figure it out on your own through a D O I process. So Nicole, would you be willing to kind of kick us off?
Nicole (41:09):
Yes. I feel like this has been sitting on my brain for a long time. My number one piece of advice is have the meeting. It’s okay like get everyone on a call because not only are you going to agree on a process and a timeline and people get to raise different, you know, red flags or green flags or whatever, but if you are struggling with what your values actually are or like what the next steps need to be for your business, just talk it out. Talk it out with the people who are actually stakeholders in your business. I think that’s such a lost part of the business experience and the entrepreneur experiences. We’ve stopped talking about it with the people who are actually in it with us. So have the meeting.
Latasha (41:55):
Mine is to not have the meeting. Just kidding.
Megan (41:57):
.
Latasha (41:59):
I’ll
Nicole (42:00):
Jump through this screen. Natasha
Latasha (42:02):
,
Latasha (42:06):
No, mine is going to be share your values and your overall strategy with the people who matter. So very similar to what Nicole said, even if it’s not in a traditional meeting setting, if you hire somebody to do graphic design for you, show them what you want to do with the business. If you’re hiring a copywriter, show them what this offer is going to do for people. It’s not just the, you know, the offer and value stack for a copywriter. It’s showing people, maybe show them the inside of your offer. Maybe show them like the people that this is gonna impact. Really giving people a taste of your vision makes anything that you outsource so much more impactful.
Megan (42:48):
And the final, the final bit of advice for me that is a little bit harder to pin down, uh, take a take. Have the meeting for sure. Take a beat before the meeting and ask, ask yourself, assess where your therapy problems are impacting your business, where you are putting, because we, we bring the, a lot of times we bring therapy problems into our business because our business is something we can control. We cannot control our therapy problems. And so a hundred percent have the meaning. This isn’t to say you need to cleave your personal self from your business self, but the more you can assess, oh, I don’t actually wanna create a new offer. I just have no control over my husband’s work at the moment. So I’m kind of bringing this in. Oh, I don’t actually need a new funnel. Uh, my wife’s on a work trip for the next three weeks and I’m feeling lonely and like I got extra time on my hands. You can still have the meeting and bring that and be like, I’ve got a ton of extra energy. Don’t let me build something new, but what can I bring a little more zaz to?
Nicole (44:02):
Yes.
Megan (44:05):
The more you can assess that before you have the meeting, the, the better the, the meeting’s gonna go, the better the product is going to be.
Latasha (44:13):
I have a follow up to that. If you just attended a coaching session, do not bring that to your team to immediately implement whatever was just covered.
Nicole (44:21):
Well, can we say it
Latasha (44:23):
Again? If you had a coaching session or you were just on a coaching call or you just attended a conference, do not jump into a team call where you start implementing that right away. You need time to process that. You need time to decide if that’s right for your business. Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (44:38):
,
Megan (44:39):
You need time to figure out if that actually applied to you. .
Bonnie (44:44):
No, but that’s real. Um, and what feels like a completely different lifetime of my business. Uh, when I was running an annual in-person retreat for creatives called the Illume retreat, uh, that was a final piece of advice that I shared with everyone on our final day as we were wrapping things up. I I, I was like, you’re filling these notebooks with all these thoughts and all these ideas and I am begging you to go home and to just sit on it and please do not go home and try to implement every single thing that every single speaker has shared with you or every single idea that came up in organic conversation with fellow attendees because that, that absolutely can point you in directions that are not in alignment with how your business actually could look or should look. So, you know, giving yourself that space, it’s what I, what I love about all the advice that y’all are sharing is it’s themes like cultivate self-awareness, it’s themes, like hone your communication with the stakeholders in your brand and hone the communication with those that are a part of your team.
Bonnie (45:59):
Um, you know, like focus on, on these incredible skills that not only are gonna serve you and your business well, but also we’re just gonna like serve you as the incredible human behind your business so incredibly well. These are, you know, we we’re applying these skills in a very professional, like very, you know, like business focused way, but communicating with the people that have, uh, you know, a vested interest in what’s going on, communicating with yourself, cultivating that self-awareness to discern what therapy thoughts maybe need to happen in a different avenue and not maybe so much in your business. , these are all, these are all really good things. So I love, I don’t know if that was intentional, but all of these things can be applied to our businesses and our lives as people. So well done, team . Yeah,
Nicole (46:50):
Just
Megan (46:50):
Like business and life intersect.
Nicole (46:52):
Oh my gosh.
Latasha (46:53):
Almost
Nicole (46:54):
.
Bonnie (46:56):
Well I know that everyone who’s been tuning in today is, um, probably low-key obsessed with y’all the way that I am. So where can they find you on the interwebs?
Latasha (47:08):
Yeah, you can find us at rendezvouscreative.com.
Nicole (47:12):
Yes. , it
Bonnie (47:16):
Was confidence for me. .
Latasha (47:21):
I had momentary panic that we had.co. Okay. .
Nicole (47:25):
Well because uncanny.co That makes sense. I know
Latasha (47:28):
Anyway, cut that. You can find us at us. Keep it rendezvous creative.com and then you can find us on Instagram at Rendezvous Creative.
Nicole (47:38):
Yes.
Bonnie (47:39):
Amazing. And, um, I know that y’all also have this really incredible resource. I think it’s this really cool quiz that people can take, um, your brand mix quiz and I’m gonna definitely have that link in the show notes for today’s episode. So y’all will definitely be able to go and grab that there. But, um, do you wanna share a little bit about what that quiz specifically covers?
Latasha (48:04):
Yeah, so usually when you are thinking about rebranding or doing something new with your brand, you are really struggling to like pinpoint what needs to change. And there’s usually one element of your brand that you focus on, right, is the visuals, but there’s actually gonna be other elements of your brand. Like we’ve talked about the four brand pillars that really need to be revised or reviewed. And this quiz will help you figure out which of those four elements, the visual, the tonal, the interpersonal or the intellectual you need to focus on to get your brand really feeling good. Again,
Megan (48:35):
We’re taking a little decision fatigue out of it for you. Just take the quiz and then you’ll know, okay, I just need to put some energy towards this.
Bonnie (48:42):
I absolutely love that, um, quiz concept and I’m definitely gonna be sharing that, um, for those who are tuning in today. So, um, as always, uh, y’all are welcome to go to brand strategy podcast.com and click on the latest episode link where you’re gonna be able to find all of the resources that were mentioned in today’s episode and all of the rendezvous creative social links and website links. So we’ll be able to go and connect with them and follow along and with what they’re doing. Um, and also there will be a full transcript of today’s, uh, episode if that is of use to you. So with all of that being said, y’all, thanks so much for joining me. I’ve had like such a blast having this conversation with you and I am just so grateful that we got a chance to dive into some of these very interesting and somewhat spicy topics today.
Nicole (49:34):
Heck, thank you so much for having us. We love talking to you,
Bonnie (49:37):
. Y’all are the best and to everyone who’s been tuning in today, as always, I’m so grateful for you. Thank you so much for sharing your time with us today and tuning in and supporting the podcast. And as always, I’m cheering y’all on from Waco.
Bonnie (49:54):
Thank you so much for joining me today. Friend. Before you go, I would be so grateful to receive your feedback on the brand strategy podcast. If you enjoyed this episode or the podcast in general has helped you grow your brand, I’d really appreciate it if you left us a review in iTunes. Your positive reviews enable the brand strategy podcast to continue to grow and reach like-minded creatives just like you. Thank you for all your support and encouragement as together we pursue building brands with purpose and intention. Until next time, I’m cheering you on from Waco.
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